Plein Air questions for Draftsmen Podcast
3yr
@Marshall Vandruff and I will be recording a podcast episode on the topic of Plein Air (painting outdoors). We'd like to hear from you before we record it.
Post some questions, concerns, stories, anything related to Plein Air and we might talk about it in the podcast. Also, feel free to respond to each others' questions here.
Thank you!
Simplifying an outdoor scene is the most difficult challenge I face when I paint outside. Tips needed.
When plein air painting what sorts of goals do you focus on? Do you approach plein air primarily to practice good design, as a color study, etc.? How do plein air sessions fit in to your overall art practice and training?
How do you apply colour vibration/ colour variation, since no object has a stationary colour, correctly to plein air paintings?
Asked for help
Hi Marshall and Stan,
I forgot to mention this in my original post but I was also wondering if you had any tips for painting at night time and carrying wet paintings back. Is there a limit of paintings you do so you don't carry too many wet paintings back that's unmanageable?
I use a very bright book light to paint under, it's a clip-on for books, but it works fine if you keep it evenly lighting the canvas and palette relatively the same way, otherwise all kinds of value skewing in your painting will result if your palette illumination is different than the surface you paint on. I scout an area way before sunset and get a drawing established on my canvas before it gets too dark to fine tune areas. Let your eye adjust to the subtle dark tones in nature after looking at your bright workspace. As for painting transport, there are so many canvas clips with handles solutions you can buy over the internet for this very thing about carrying wet paintings home, otherwise just leave the painting on the easel clamp and carry it that way. HTH.
I paint mostly in the urban environment with acrylic paint on 9x12 panels. ACM panels are great to paint with, they're lightweight and durable. Oil paint is great but I like working in water based media because of my work flow and clean up.
Two plein air artists come to mind when I'm on instagram: James Gurney, and Marc Dalessio.
Viewing a gallery that exhibits plein air paintings here in NYC is rare, unknown to me. Grand Central Atelier held a plein air exhibit once in Long Island City a few years ago, and I was pumped.
Are there published critics of contemporary plein air paintings? Until then, one might run into Jerry Saltz at a major art museum and he might dispense a few nuggets. In passing once, he said something about escaping the pathos of Hopper, which sounds right.
Could plein air painting also be thought of as performance art?
When is this segment airing? Thanks for thinking of plein air painting, I can't wait to hear this!
I feel like I already learned a lot just reading this thread! Can’t wait for the podcast 👍
What do you think are pros and cons to using watercolours/gouache, oils, acrylics, maybe even inks, when doing plein air paintings? There's no right or wrong and it's probably personal preference but I'm just curious as a beginner
Start very basic with new materials. Practice value studies with a warm/cool palette of a brown color and a blue color plus white. Water base paints are easier to work with in all aspects, very portable, and there's more room for experimentation and combination of media possible; oils require more careful setup and clean up.
Asked for help
Are proportional dividers a crutch that will eventually hinder my learning? I pick two landmarks for datums, eg bottom and left edge, and use proportional dividers to map features onto my paper/canvas.
I've seen people start plein air paintings, then after a certain amount of time when there have been too many changes in the environment, they work on it again in studio, from imagination or a reference photo they took at the site. What do artist typically change or look for when starting a plein air painting, then adjusting and finishing the painting later in the studio?
In the beginning, plein air artists want a good visual foundation to support the subsequent stages of the painting, usually a simple harmony of abstract shapes at first. A lot of conflict, surprise, and intuition, too, enters into the creation of the painting. If they take on new information in a scene that they haven't tried painting before, they might take risks during the act of painting to express what they see; they may not succeed at first. They may have a revelation afterwards and use the painting in the studio to experiment and learn from.
Asked for help
When I paint plein air I find myself muddling around in middle values, trying to grasp and translate the light pattern right in front of me. Can you talk about ways to quickly launch yourself into a fairly accurate, overall value pattern so that you can get to the refinement stage sooner?
Also do you think it would be interesting to compare and contrast the plein air vs urban sketching traditions? Thanks!
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3yr
I like to start with a thumbnail sketch with pencil in my sketchbook before jumping into the painting. I spend maybe 5 minutes on it to get the large shapes and values working. This gives me confidence when I start the layin on the canvas.
Asked for help
Hi, I was really struggling with getring started, it seems like a lot to learn and as a beginner, with so much stuff and without an instructor how to know where to begging, is so confusing
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3yr
If you are new to painting I would not start with plein air painting. Start by setting up a SIMPLE still life at home. Try to increase your chances of a win as your starting. Paint a pear, banana, spoon, teacup... Painting is complicated. Start with something you can actually control at first and increase difficulty as you get comfortable with it.
Also, there's a great Vitual Plein Air group on facebook for those who are interested. They paint from MapCrunch and Google street views!
https://www.facebook.com/groups/290155717818479
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3yr
lol, this is wonderful.
I feel like I've been held back from really exploring plein air by the equipment. Doesn't hold things at the right height or angle, not enough space to efficiently carry my tools. Do you have any advice or recommendations to address this? Or, should I take the James Gurney route and make my own modifications to my setup?
I have a very streamlined set up for Plein Air. I agree with Stan, learn to condense your gear to fit in a backpack. I want to be able to have my hands free as I walk or hike into the area that I am going to paint. I paint with several people that use a tote with wheels but they are often limited to roadside views.
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3yr
If you feel inspired by to make your own, then go for it. I don't like the wooden French easels much. I've used the strada easel and soltek. Both are great. I don't try to carry all my gear in the easel. Instead I have a small hiking backpack with all my stuff.
Hi Stan and Marshall! Thank you for doing an episode on this topic for the podcast.
I used to travel and sketch with watercolours back when we could. At the moment I try to paint sunsets when I see a nice one since I know photos don't capture them well but with a sunset of course light changes quickly. I was wondering if you have any tips or tricks for capturing a sunset.
I also have a pochade box with water soluble oil paint in it I'd like to take traveling internationally with me someday. Do you guys have any tips or information about taking oil paint or water soluble oil paint on a plane? Do you bring that in your hand luggage or do you have to check it in? Do you bring msds about dangerous goods and whatnot?
Thank you so much for your help and thank you for running this show.
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3yr
I've done sunset painting several times and each time I had to paint extremely quick. 15-30 minutes until the light is totally different. So, when painting sunsets I end up doing 3-5 smaller thumbnails instead.
Traveling with paint is tricky because at the airport any time they see 'paint' they will default to throwing it away. I've heard of some artists putting paint in a separate bag and labeling it "artists colors". Avoid using the word 'paint'.
These might help:
https://www.menorcapulsar.com/free-ebook/how-to-travel-with-oil-paints
https://gamblincolors.com/tips-for-traveling-with-artists-materials/
How long should you spend on a plein air oil painting in nature, given the changing of light and weather etc. Thanks!
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3yr
A normal session for me is 3 hours. Sometimes I will go for small quick sketches with 2x 90 minute paintings or 3x 60 minute paintings.
Asked for help
Hello! I have 2 questions:
- As much as I want to try Plein Air, it's still very difficult to do it here due to our pandemic protocols. What's the closest thing that I can do that's similar to it at home?
- My comfort zones are sketching & inking at the moment, but I've been dipping my toes into digital painting lately. I shared some values master studies, and an old work of mine with a mini environment in it. What can I do to become comfortable with painting more?
What prefered medium do you use for plein air? Goache, Oil, watercolor or something else?
Second question, do you look for something specific in the environment, to get a good plein air session?
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3yr
My preferred medium is oils.
When selecting, I look for something that inspires me. Sometimes it can be a grand landscape or sometimes its a rock.. When I can see the finished painting before I start, it usually turns out better.
